UPDATE! Saturday, 5th January 2008: Independent Day-Out Fest, MCPA, KL


Joe hoards and shares.

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31 Responses

  1. letupan di langit says:

    wow!force vomit pon ada..
    don’t give up..!owh siti don’t give up..!!
    pasti siti akan datang ini gig..hehe

  2. undefinedtoit says:

    m goin

  3. xjohnxdoe says:

    how can carburator playing with scum like hujan..? those musician is from mainstream where their attention to b rockstar wannabe? Wait till M nasir turns indie! and for me they using the scene. its funny how over the years things have become diverse from what is strongly believe from few years back?

    And now everyone who are old timer in the scene some sort ignoring the fact band like hujan should has place in the scene.

    so funny they also been add as the sejarah of malaysia indiependent music ?

    And now another funny story seing CARBURATOR DUNG play with them>? What happen JOE KID?

    and hujan are now in the radio station everywhere (where few years back so many people would stab other back or maki any band who try to make it to the mainstream,,,, ).. 🙂

    I dont mind the real kids go out there and shake the mainstream not some mainstream band using the scene to prove they are something.

  4. Joe Kidd says:

    Dear John Doe,

    Thanks for being so concerned about my band’s well-being. We really do appreciate it.

    We have actually been taking a lot of vitamin shots and also having mandi bunga, so that the Hujan virus would not infect us. Hopefully after the show we would not change our name to Ribut Taufan dan yang sewaktu dengannya.

    At the moment, I’m more worried about our drummer who is having some terrible demam. Which means that we cannot rehearse! Dang! The Hujan virus is very the terrible, it’s already at work!!

    For those who are very the LEBAI one and sembahyang tak tinggal also, please do pray for us. God bless.

    p/s: must remind myself to bring some holy water and also silver-tipped bullets. groan.

  5. xjohnxdoe says:

    I don’t mean bout their music preference would make kids or CarDung played like they do. How they work and use the scene.

    Before any kids or band try to do something different aka so called BIG at that time was been pointing finger and called names… now people who have no real struggle can easily has place in the scene. Its so funny before when some kids been kick about ticket price. Distribution CD price, try do big shows, bands try to promote their music differently or just to struggle to help the scene have been pick on or point finger.

    And this days.. the corporate already in the scene hiding behind mask of DIY by using their tool.

    Few month back when i start comment bout that band how many people ignore it. “So what if they are rappers or in major label band before…” most would say that.

    For me they don’t have the struggle and attitude to prove they are honest band just simply by looking the cd sleeve which have big company to help them.isn’t that good enough to say they are just bunch musician try to make it..

    To see label that so punk so crust so hardcore organizing shows for them make me laugh? Why change so fast while before when someone or band try to do something you stab them in the back with so many reason from ticket price to cd price to distribution price even their personal lives.

    so i wonder.. what have happen…?

    And does this band layak to be call “Malaysia History of independent scene” while there are lots of band who struggle their way to make the scene listening their music over the years.

    Yeah i concern about Carburator Dung because you have inspired people over the years yet playing with some band who don’t have the struggle especially when the musician its from MAINSTREAM and look at the CARTA radio nowdays how can they easily make it without help from people in mainstream?.And now their EP CD which before cost RM10 now have become RM15?

    “Jack Grisham TSOL – No band in DIY will think bout being in the radio because we do for fun and loving it and we never think about selling tons of records”

  6. Joe Kidd says:

    “I don’t mean bout their music preference would make kids or CarDung played like they do. How they work and use the scene.”

    Good to know that Hujan virus would not infect us and affect the way we do what we do. Whew!


    Morning John! You’re up early! Anyway, sorry if my answer above seems a bit like trying to belittle your “concerns”. I can’t help it! Heh!

    Anyway, lets get a bit serious lah. I have a lot to say about your comments and I will go through it one by one. Here’s the first one:

    “Before any kids or band try to do something different aka so called BIG at that time was been pointing finger and called names”

    I believe what you saying is that in the (“good”) old days when bands tried to go further than the “underground” scene and set their aim at the bigger mainstream world they would be attacked and pointed down for taking that route or even thinking of taking that route.

    And I believe what you mean is that we all should do that to any band from the scene that tries to go further, that is try to bring them down. Point our fingers to them and say, “you’re a sell-out! fuck you!”. What you want is people in the scene to come out and do that again.

    Truth is, maybe not many people are writing here and “pointing fingers” and saying this and that but there are a lot of them doing so quietly, discussing it amongst their friends, without declaring it to the world here. Basically, you are not alone, there are many who feel the same.

    Honestly, I do that too, sometimes, but at the end of the day, I’m not someone who would shove my opinions down people’s throats and force people to “follow my way, or else.”

    I have always believed in having your own choices. Follow your own instincts, instead of following what other people want out of you.

    You want to call people “sell-outs” and boycott the bands for not being “DIY” according to your standards, go ahead. And if you have a band and want your band to go out to the mainstream and be a careerist musician which plays the game, go ahead also lah. It’s your prerogative.

    Nowadays I think the kids in the scene are not moving as a group with that oppressive “herd mentality” anymore. Not as a group anyway. Choices are being made as an “individual” rather than as a collective. The scene and its politics does not dictate your course.

    What it does is presenting personal choices, so instead of forcing a certain “rule” by way of some “peer pressure”, threats of boycotts or some form of “blackmail”, it gives you the freedom to choose. At the same time it still allows for people like you to voice out your opinions and say what you think is right, or wrong.

    I’m all for this. It’s a hell lot more healthier than being a part of a herd of sheep that goes here and there with a single thought governing the whole gang. Everyone is allowed to have his or her own opinions and everyone is allowed to disagree. And from there, you choose your own path, or lines to draw.

    And as long as your choice does not end up with you harming anyone, you will have my respect and support.

  7. Joe Kidd says:

    “… now people who have no real struggle can easily has place in the scene.”

    I think, nobody OWNS the scene. I have always believe that the “scene” is a free space for anyone to go into and do what they want.

    And we have seen many who used the scene as a stepping stone into the mainstream, and we have also seen many who had stood fast and refused to go for the carrots dangled by the business entities out there.

    And I have also seen many “veterans” who are feeling bitter because the “scene” had stopped them from going further into the money-making world of entertainment.

    And I have also seen many who are bitter because some of their friends have gone ahead and became “stars” and betrayed their “principles” and ethical concerns.

    And I have seen so many who would just dropped-out and calls the scene as erm, “that was my adolescent phase”.

    I’m all for that. The scene is a democratic space and it should always be an open and welcoming one. The doors are always open, so you can go in and out as you please. I’m not gonna be that guy at the door, the abang guard, the fascist dictator who would require “borang-borang keahlian” and also “karangan surat lima sebab-sebab kenapa kamu harus masih lagi diterima sebagi ahli”. Hahah!

  8. Joe Kidd says:

    Shit! time is not on my side. I want to write more and comment on your thoughts but dang! I have a show to attend to in a few hours! But I’ll be back!



  9. robotnik says:

    Ribut Taufan? Macam tahu jeeeeee. Hehehehehe :p :p :p

  10. xjohnxdoe says:

    I agree with the “choice” part. For me myself i don’t mind if people wanna do whats best for him or her. But why after all this years? What happen to the kids who have been pointed at before?

    Their struggle been question. The band been point out? I mean if we let them do the course itself from the start we wont see old bands faded. The Distributor dried out because no money to roll over because someone said the CD is expensive. The old organiser dont have bad names because someone saying his/her making money. Or Ticket price which have make some kids fighting each other.or called names as homophobic band. Yah we dont want this to happen today? but what happen to people who have been hurt before?

    Now Carburator Dung have played with few bands who have sign to some “issues” label. How come.? I dont mind at all whichever band CD played? but what happen before CD will not play with certain band?

    And as said by some friend CD also hav played with homophobic band in this show.

    I don’t mind whatever have scene become today?But What happen to the kids who are struggle before who been hurt and been accused?

  11. asa takkan mati says:

    are they(HUJAN) really a homophobics? because i heard it too. can someone please make me clear?

  12. Joe Kidd says:

    Hello John,

    The show was mad. At the end of the day I heard there were around 2000 kids cramming up the halls. There were two performance spaces; the smaller one had acoustic and pared-down electric sets with 20+ acts playing, the other room is almost 3 times bigger with 13 bands playing from noon till late night.

    Out on the foyer you had about 20 tables selling merchandises, mostly t-shirts and printed matters. We missed most of the other bands sets since we had to go to Pandan to rehearse but when we went into the bigger room at about 8.30pm we had to fight our way through the mostly late-teens, early-20s crowd. It was so hot and humid through out the day & night I heard about 20 of them fainted from sheer heat exhaustion.

    At the end of the night I think both organisers did very well. It must be crazy trying to keep things under control and have it running smoothly but I believe it was a very successful one. There were quite a number of kids helping out, right from manning the crowd, taking care of the doors to the crews manning the stage and the sound etc.

    There’s no presence of any big companies, conglomerates, corporates etc. There’s no NOKIA logos, nor EMI, Tiger Beers banners etc. None. There was also no parading arseholes, no senseless violent bullshit, etc. etc. It was just a lot of kids of different races, gender and persuasions crammed up together and having lots sweaty of rock’n’roll fun.

    On another plane, they had a huge variety of musical persuasions, from Abroko playing his Syd Barrett tribute to Force Vomit playing their 60s twangy homage. In between those two you have so many different tunage you rarely see at a now too commonly one-dimensional gigs around us.

    Yes, it was NOT a “DIY hardcore punk rock” show, and yes, at RM25 a pop it was a bit more than usual and yes, it featured quite a few bands who I would normally avoid playing with.

    I have no problems with playing indie-rock shows, in fact I prefer a lot of different genres at the show we play anyway. Punk rock shows can be so one-dimensional and honestly, quite boring.

    I have no problems with the RM25 too, as it is a big show with so many bands and so much effort to undertake and so many personnel to be rewarded accordingly. But I do have problems with some of the bands playing, basically due to the fact that they would readily work with entities which I find problems with. But that’s just me.

    When the organisers first invited me to play at the acoustic stage, I refused, solely because there were some minor “disagreeable bands” on the list. Three weeks later they told me the main band pulled out and they asked my band to play the main stage as the last minutes replacement. I still have my reservations but I put the question up to the other guys in the band. They all agreed to just play and help out.

    And yes, in the end we did it, we pulled our shit together and had quite a good time; and some of you are now crying foul. But that is expected. It is understandable, and it’s heartening to know people still care. Heheh!

    At the end of the day though, it was good that we play. At the very least I feel great being able to help a bunch of old friends who have always been good to us. What I saw at the show was a bunch of kids doing it for the other kids, just like the usual indie or DIY gigs done in a large scale, maybe 20 times the scale.

    I’m not going to speculate on how much money were made, or how that money was or going to be distributed among the entities responsible. I even may disagree on certain things, but it’s not a show I organised, so it would be pretty silly of me to interfere.

    Bodysurf Music has been around for 10 long years, the gang had gone through a lot shit trying to keep afloat and they are still struggling to this very day. They deserve a bit cash flow, so I’m happy for them. I have known them from day one and of course we have our disagreements but that’s just life lah.

    As for Theatrical, they are quite a new bunch, so I can’t say much apart from the fact that they really worked hard these past 6 months; from running a cheap recording and jamming studio in the deepest Puchong to lending their PA system and backline to other promoters, to organising mid-range gigs etc. Through out the years there were so many kids from the scene who want (or wanted) to do the same, but so far only these guys are doing it with much aplomb.

    OK. I find it tiresome and seriously funny that I have to this all the time. Explaining my actions to the world. I could have just ignore it and be damned! I remember a friend of mine sighing loudly at me, he asked why I put myself in this position. A very good question indeed. It is also a question which I never really sat down with and contemplate. Maybe I should.

  13. weasel says:

    awesome show CD!!!dont give a shit CD play with hujan, rain or apo apo la..CD was CD and still is CD until today…nvr dissapointed me lah, to brother joe rajin2 la jam byk lg lagu best yg xmain..chiss!

  14. zkuning says:

    hei joe thats kind of …ya..sound tired but you know sometime it is good to explain yourself and what or why you do certain thing in certain place with people who can be considered simply clown. i did the same sometime performing inbetween people whom i had no interest in their creative input…but to me after all this year how could once in awhile things like that (whatever we do appear ‘self contradictory’ or ‘sell-out'(?) can change my senses and inner world?

    but you know at time explaining your artisic ‘integrity’ and ‘way of your things’ not only help others to understand themself but also ourself..so rock and roll boss.. the ‘report’ was nice. thanks and hope to see you sometime later

  15. zkuning says:

    but i do think what john is saying is something worth thinking about b’cos sometime…ya sometime you just dont want to play with some fucking asshole on the same stage and gig. of cos the scene (socalled) is as open as the sky for all to try their luck but …ya but..but ‘punk’ (not necessarily underground) in many ways are territorial if not tribal. ‘it’ got to ‘protect’ itself from to much of ‘everything and anything oklah’. that kind of sucks big time boss.

    here in spore recently theres a big mambojambo that ‘our’ MDA (if im not mistaken it stand for minestry of development in/or/of the arts) make a short promo video with the staff (directors and whoever they are) rapping around with fingers in the air and dress up like some freeeking nerd with fake gold chain doing jingelyjangle on ..well hiphop music. we thought if they can sell hardcore (oldsckool haha) music as mainstream as hiphop i guest me, joe and the rest of the old punk can start listen to M Daud Kilau as if theres nothing else to listen any more.

    so i think sometime its good not to mix to much (not that im such a purist) unless its a ‘peace concert’ againts american tyrant syndrome

  16. Joe Kidd says:

    Weasel, thank you for the kind words, it is much appreciated, but at the end of the day we really do give a shit. There are a lot of fucken bullshit out there which we cannot ignore and we are not about to give up the fight and be a bunch of bitter old bastards moaning about the good old days.

    Just don’t expect us to play by YOUR rules or YOUR expectations. We have gone through a lot of shit through out the 18+ years we have been together, and there are a lot of grey areas out there which you HAVE to deal with. And these grey areas changes with the times; it’s not always the same and it’s not always black and white, the path is not always squeaky clean and sometimes you will still have to step on some foul cow dung and urine,

    That said, we appreciate people who give a shit about our band and our actions. And we appreciate people who throw shit at us, after all, throwing shit at each other is good thing, that is as long as it is good shit lah. Heheh!

  17. Joe Kidd says:

    Yes Zai, I am tired. Well, I was up with a couple of friend yakking away (“fight knowledge” for some people lah) till 5.30 am this morning and that really did me in lah.

    Going back to the comments made by our dear John, yes I do agree, it’s important and yes, we need it but I do really wish he would write it in a clearer manner!

    Don’t pay too much time on my little whine about being tired of it though. I admit it is annoying, but that is solely because I would expect people to know better after all these years. But that’s my bad lah.

    Yes, the “punk rock” community and its many varied related cliques and offshoots are mainly “tribal” and yes, they are full of territorial pissing, but that is not always good. The community can also be too full of itself to allow for differences in opinions, ideas and even in their appreciation of variety.

    And that “perangai” would eventually lead to fucken stale uniformity, sheep-like mentality and the fear of pushing these boundaries erected around us. That is happening all over the world, the community is stagnant, unadventurous and appear like a bunch of self-imposed ghettos governed by blinded dogmatic values which has killed its potential as a vibrant, creative community.

    Ideally, it is a community which engages and confront the masses out there, but what’s happening now is the opposite. At the moment, its anger and concerns are mainly turned inward, its ideas and actions isolated from the general domain by its own creed thus it is a marginalised community condemned by its own actions.

    All of that is of no use to anyone. That is unless you really want nothing but a hole for yourself and your friends to circle-pit in till the mortgage comes a-calling.

    BTW, Zai. When are you free for all of us to get back together and fuck shit up again eh?

  18. zkuning says:

    hei joe ya i know what you mean but lets not get to surprise or disappointed when all the thing you say is actually what grow in many people.

    anyway it will be great for all of us to meet again in a studio cooking up some stuff. i will be free only after march. lets see if i can go up and make some noice.

  19. That said, we appreciate people who give a shit about our band and our actions. And we appreciate people who throw shit at us, after all, throwing shit at each other is good thing, that is as long as it is good shit lah

    thats why we call it DUNG isn’t it right Joe??

  20. Joe Kidd says:

    Correcto mundo, Jimmy sir!

  21. RIBUT says:

    corporate punk…

  22. bornagainst says:

    Just wondering what do xjohnxdoe mean by struggle in his earlier post >> “now people who have no real struggle can easily has place in the scene”.

    What if a band who has to go through a struggle in life for example like being poor, sick or whatever and they like indie or some other genre music and they form a band and playing a music they like is a way of escape. And by wanting to go major/mainstream so that they can make a living and escape from the struggle, is that wrong? Maybe in a DIY punk/hardcore mindset, that would like the ultimate crime but this is 2008 and not 1988.

    Things changed, music changed, people changed, societies changed, mindset changed and the line between the mainstream and underground have been blurred in terms of sound and they way people work. I’m not saying that going major is good but its all about choices these days and respecting em. RESPECT is the way to go this.

    My point being that if a band who struggles to get gigs or shows or exposure, theres the internet and if you think your music is not good enough not likeable enough for you to get a show and be popular, change or you can always try somewhere else. It might sound easy but I guess alot of sacrifices need to be made for all of this to happen.

    And if you don’t like something, do something about it rather than just babbling about it only.

    Before thinking that corporate is evil, we’re surrounded by it. You don’t havta conform to it. I guess you just have to work around it. If you can’t fight it, join it and fuck it. 😉

  23. thee dr. says:

    so what you’re trying to say is tom from the bollocks/76 seconds is now in carburetor dung?sweeet

  24. Joe Kidd says:

    Dear Doctor, Tom is indeed a part of Dung now, but I’m quite fearful of his “metal” licks! That boy can really go “widdly-widdly” shreds on the frets and I’m afraid he has to tone that down and go for the good ol’ Fast Eddie or Grant Estes solos instead. I have been asking Fendi to allow us to get another guitarist for years now, he always vetoed the idea, so this is exciting!

  25. weasel says:

    oh okay..i guess it’s hard to fit in or be what you wanna be..by being yourself…alot of question and so unbalanced shite! =) i think i should free myself first

  26. weasel says:

    but i gave a shit about CD…so afraid if CD end up signing cntrct with big label yadda yadda ignore me

  27. Joe Kidd says:

    weasel, terima kasih boss.

  28. Pijan says:

    Fuk shit up. ticket RM25! i just skipped the bouncer by pretending to be Abu Rocco supporting band. One of the bouncer sings one of the CD’s song and he seem very nice to me after the show. Tough guy! I thought you’re ok after all man! Oh ya, Sid and Zafran as well, pretended to be a member of Civil Disorder to get free-entrance since their anarcho-punk outlook is very convincing them! Haha! Hey Robert, you makes me come to this show damn man! Yeah! He’s Robert Eggplant, a friend’s of Jesse Operation Ivy during their teenage age!
    Ok, back to the story, we lost about an hour and trapped in the heavy traffic as I thought the show was held in Chin Wu Hall. Damn my beer turns warm, we just get drinking in my car.
    Oh ya, thinking about this homophobes lads,Hujan..why everyday now give a damn about them? Confront them and tell them straight man! Unless you’re living in Ithaca and hard for you to see them live. I dont even wanna know them from day one. I just wanna steal their homophobes /religious fans!Yes I do! ask Sid if you dont believe me! Hahaha! After appear on t.v and major newspaper, well i dont know, but in my definition they’re excluded from my very own d.i.y context! Be yourself! haha that’s pretty much funny phrase I’ve ever heard! You guys always proud debated using this fuk up anglo-american english language here! Even Joe always make fun out of my words due to my mispronounciation and grammar error. Haha! I know Joe you’re fukin ex-journalist man! I’m a fuk up civil engineer who comes from small town. I’m ok. No problem brader..What I really dont agree with the idea of debating long long way here is, when you see face to face you seem dont have much to talk, only one or two words or less. That’s pretty sucks!
    Wei! oklah penat aku nak tulis lagi. Kenapa kau orang semua suka menyamar eh? Boleh aku berkenalan? hehe..Yang aku kenal kat sini, Joekidd, Kuning, lain tu ntah sapa ntah! hey sugar-pop Weasel! kau takut Joe sign major? Apa nak hairan Joe memang poser! kah kah kah
    Well aku ckp mcm ni jgn lah kau org ingat aku ni true sgt! Zaman I.S.A lagi kitorang dah ada lagu “fuk u, we’re not true!” Biasalah, dlm scene punk mmg mcm ni, apa aje yg kau buat mesti kene criticize beb! Scene indie-pop aku x ambik port lah! Tp satu minah dpd band Astrella kata dia, ya allah nak jual cd dia kat aku RM30 sebijik! katanya roslan aziz ke sapa ntah yg produce. ingat malaysian idol ke? itu aku malas nak campur scene indie-pop kat KL ni. Tp sebab minah ni cun, aku pun layan kan aje lah! kalau Sid dah beli tu! Hehe 🙂
    Oh ya, 2/3/08, hari ahad, kitorang(Joekid+aku+mantol+fahmi fsf+man sjn hasan kot) ada host satu show ‘undercover gig’ kat annexe. Semua band2 d.i.y akan cover lagu orang lain dan main konsep berbeza. Dtg jgn x dtg! Dan dlm bulan 5 plk, aku ada bwk band dari new york, I Farm main sini! Best ni, bassist Murphy’s Law dah main ngn diorang!Bulan depan, aku + shammir tak hensem akan release tour cd diorang.

    “Be different, get different!” ahh..apa2 aje lah!

  29. Pijan says:

    Ops, panjangnya..tak perasan plk aku.
    hari ni aku mmg betul2 tension melayan ragam architect KLCC.

  30. thee dr. says:

    he’s a pretty good guitar player/ songwriter so i’m sure he’s gonna be a pretty good asset-he does like his metal tho…especially sepultura i think and some other mallcore that was passing as ‘hardcore’ back in the day…it’s wierd thinking about it now but tons of people used to say bands like pantera and machine head were ‘hardcore’…wierd

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